#tmagp theory
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SO theory time
We now have to cases of dead people narrating how they died to their greatest fear, as called out by Sam which gives two options
One; they are victims from the eyepocalypse come through to this universe
Two; the [ERROR] released from the institute Is somehow killing people with their worst fear and making them do this, which does seem to align with the idea the [ERROR] is a mess of all the fears, I mean it's literally making zombies and they narrate their death and worst fear that caused it
#tmagp#tmp#the magnus protocol theory#the magnus protocol spoilers#the magnus protocol#tmp theory#tmp spoilers#tmagp theory#tmagp spoilers
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Sam fumbled Gwen’s Bonzo reveal… but he’d been primed to do so
I suspect that there's going to be a LOT of conversation around Sam after this episode, and since this episode was so good that I couldn't think of a meme or shitpost, I decided I'd throw my hat into the ring and do some character analysis instead. CW: Spoilers for The Magnus Protocol episode 18, "Solo Work" under the cut.
Episode 18 finally gave us the Sam and Gwen interaction I (and I think a lot of others) have been so desperate to finally see, and boy oh boy do I have Thoughts… none of which are new per se, but Sam’s reaction to Gwen dropping the Bonzo Bomb seems to have reinforced the way I’ve been reading (and projecting in fanfiction oops) Sam, his personality, and his motivations.
Out of everyone new we’ve been introduced to so far, Sam has by far gotten the most explicit development and conversation around his personality. Even before episode 1, folks who participated in the ARG got a preview of our favorite baby shrimp’s personality through access to the child database spreadsheet that was, presumably, used to document the results of the experiments run on children participating in The Magnus Institute’s “gifted and talented program.” From this spreadsheet, we can gather that Baby Sam is logical, empathetic, works towards the benefit of others (prosocial), and fair… but also a rule follower and highly willing to follow the lead of an authority figure, even if it is in conflict with his personal views. The picture this information paints is an interesting one, but when taken in a vacuum leaves us with an impression of Sam as someone who is kind but lacking in backbone.
This idea of Sam as “kind but lacking in backbone” is further reinforced in canon, as Alice of multiple occasions rags on him for being “noodly” and “ickle fawn” and a “baby shrimp,” all seeming to highlight that Sam has the sort of helplessness about him typically ascribed to sopping wet kittens and baby birds. And I think that if we view Sam’s outburst when Gwen brings up Bonzo through this lens alone, it’s going to seem WAY out of character for him and a downright cruel response.
Now while I do believe that Sam is empathetic and fair and, sometimes, a little helpless, I’ve been inclined to believe from early on that much of Sam’s affable self-deprecation is a way to cover or soften what can be, at times, a tendency to be hard-headed, temperamental, a little manipulative, and petty (and I’m totally not just saying that as a people-pleaser-and-gifted-kid-in-recovery who has been projecting hard on Sam since Day 1). And it’s this second batch of personality traits, the ones that make Sam so real and interesting to me, that I think set up the disaster of a conversation between Sam and Gwen.
We have definitely seen hints of Sam’s hard-headedness and manipulative leanings in previous episodes: it comes out most often around Alice, showing his stubbornness in the form of refusing to give up his lines of questioning and curiosity about what is happening in the cases and at the OIAR; and revealing his willingness to manipulate a situation the form of subtly redirecting Alice’s focus away from prying into his crush on Celia and during the mocha incident (I have, of course, already explored Sam’s manipulative tendencies in my totally comprehensive shitpost).
And we’ve even been shown at times before episode 18 where Sam can be petty, his buzzed insistence that Alice try and keep things “professional” at work after his date with Celia being at the top of the list. The case headers filed for “Putting Down Roots” and “Pet Project” also suggest to me Sam’s ability to be stubborn and petty: in both instances, Alice and Gwen suggest a different classification than the one that Sam ultimately files. In the case of Gwen in “Pet Project,” she’s dismissive of him when he tries to ask if she’s all right.
While there’s no way to know for sure, I interpret this interaction as part of the reason why Sam ultimately disregarded Gwen’s suggestion for how to file the case—she shut him down and shut him out, and the petty part of his heart couldn’t resist ignoring her recommendation out of spite. This scene also begins to lay the foundations for Sam and Gwen’s interactions in episode 18 and, I suspect, the rest of the season.
So with all of this in mind, let’s look at episode 18. When Gwen emerges from Lena’s office, Alice has just finished shutting Sam down, again. Throughout most of this season, Sam has been desperate for some validation that the cases they are listening to are real, that whatever happened to him at The Magnus Institute was real, and that him pursuing this line of questioning and wanting to find answers isn’t a waste of his time. Alice has, of course, been not-so-gently nudging him away from this line of thinking for most of the season, while Gwen has been icing him out about it up until this point. Just about the only one who has given his questioning any air has been Celia who is, conveniently, not there. Even after Alice has her very own supernatural experience that is reaffirmed in the case Sam receives, she strongly pushes back on his idea that they should investigate and pursue this further. He understands why she doesn’t want to learn more, but it’s clear that he’s still frustrated at the end of the conversation.
Enter Gwen. Here, for the first time, it seems like she’s opening up about what is going on at the OIAR, and Sam is immediately hooked, even dropping his softer and sympathetic side when Alice tries to redirect with one of her classic barbs.
After being shut down time and time again, Sam is so eager for confirmation that there is more to all of this than meets the eye. And then Gwen says the B-word, and Sam loses it.
Sam is laughing here, but honestly? I think he’s angry, and his reaction is one of complete disbelief that Gwen would set him up like this just to, in his mind, take the piss out of him. He thinks that, at best, Gwen is having a breakdown and he’s once again being shut out or, at worst, Gwen is making a joke at his expense. Now, he’s used to being the butt of a joke thanks to being friends with Alice, but despite that we’ve never heard him call her an asshole the way he does Gwen. Temperamental and petty, turning around his hurt and anger over being stonewalled again and again to lash out at Gwen with his joke.
And honestly, can you blame him? (I can’t.)
Of course this wasn’t the ideal reaction. I have been waiting for Sam and Gwen to have a serious heart-to-heart about what’s going on forever, and Sam pretty much blew that chance without even realizing it. And I would be surprised if we get an apology out of him anytime soon, not only because this interaction is likely to push Gwen away from wanting to even be around Sam, but also because he’s not going to believe that Gwen wasn’t making fun of him or that Gwen isn’t having a delusional breakdown until he sees Mr. Bonzo with his own two eyes.
I also think this conversation would have gone very differently had Celia been there instead of Alice. Sam’s slew of psychological testing suggests he’s willing to follow the leader, and in this case he doesn’t seem immune to Alice’s general dismissiveness of Gwen. He may have even been primed to lash out at Gwen in this moment because Alice is constantly ragging on her; chameleon-like, he’ll take on the shade of the strongest personality when he’s on uncertain or dangerous footing. It’s almost a guarantee that Celia would have taken Gwen seriously, not only because she’s likely from or connected to the TMA-verse of horrors, but also because it was Celia who received the first Mr. Bonzo case. And had Celia been there to temper the disbelief, Sam would have absolutely been ready to hear Gwen out in full. I honestly cannot wait for Celia to be back in office; she’s going to walk in to these new, rancid office vibes like Troy from Community walking into the whole room on fire while casually carrying the pizza.
So, what do I think this means for the rest of the season? Well, the title of this episode seems telling: Solo Work. Gwen and Sam’s respective desires for their experiences to be validated and their goals to be taken seriously paired with the seeming dismissiveness of those around them are going to push them along their separate paths, dangerously alone. And I suspect that it is only going to be Celia or, more likely, an encounter with Bonzo, that is going to put them back on the same path—if it happens at all. Good luck, babes!
#The Magnus Protocol#tmagp#tmagp theory#tmagp spoilers#The Magnus Protocol spoilers#tmagp ep 18#tmagp solo work#samama khalid#Sam Khalid#gwen bouchard#the magnus institute#character analysis#sam khalid character analysis#Teal's TMAGP takes
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Hold up .
Did this universe’s Georgie sound…. SCARED of Celia spying/reporting things…???? I just broke a blood vessel is wear
#tmagp spoilers#tmagp#tmagp theory#tmagp 18#tmp#tmp spoilers#georgie barker#scared? not her! :( I hope not#the magnus protocol
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Guys… the Royal Mint Court where the OIAR offices are is referred to as the “Johnson Smirke building” It was designed in 1805 by James Johnson and was constructed a few years later after he died by ROBERT SMIRKE. + was named to honour the two architects. …I need to lie down.
#alex and johnny i’m in your walls#i can’t breathe guys#tmagp theory#the magnus protocol#tmagp#tma#robert smirke#tmagp 18
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ROBERT SMIRKE? THE FEARS TRADEMARK ROBERT SMIRKE?????) OHHHHHH THEY ARE COOKING
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Something about Celia possibly being Celia from the Cult of Post-Changed World in MAG, which makes her Lynne Hammond. Who had the ghost of Agnes Montague in her apartment.
And Celia in TMAGP has a kid named Jack, as in Jack Barnabas, someone who Agnes loved
#tmagp#tmagp spoilers#tmagp theory#tma podcast#the magnus archives#the magnus protocol#agnes montague#jack barnabas#celia ripley
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You know, I’m starting to think that the computer voices are a bit of a red herring. I don’t think Chester is actually Jon, or our Jon.
Instead, I’m thinking that [ERROR] is our Jon. I just relistened to a bit of the episode where it appears and the whispered voices in the background sound vaguely like Jon, plus that’s the first time we hear a tape recorder click.
Now, there is an avatar of some sort going around and pulling the final moments from people who clearly have been impacted by an Entity (whether this universe’s or the other’s), with one of those statements even mentioning a figure in an alley asking questions.
These are all ticking the Jon box for me.
#I know we all want him to be chester from the puter but#hear me out#what if chester IS this universe’s jon#that’s his be all end all#I’m thinking [error] is our jon#our wet cat of a man just more monster-y#oh please let it be so <3#tmagp#tma#tmagp theory#the magnus archives#the magnus protocol#just a buzzing bee
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Whoever you are on the patreon, you’re cooking. This has to be something, right???
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A figure asking questions in an alley? Could the question be “can I have a cigarette”??? This feels like such a direct angler fish reference yet I have no idea what it could mean? Or maybe I’m just spiraling too far
#the magnus archives#the magnus protocol#tmagp#tma#tmagp spoilers#tmagp theory#magnus protocol#someone help#also Georgie what do you mean who took Georgie’s face I’m worried about u girl
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Current theory now is that Celia really is from U1, and this Georgie isn't. However I'm still attached to the idea that the TMA tapes are physically present and known in this universe. Hence Georgie's paranoia: various shadowy instances have tried to find and spy on the tmagp versions of all relevant actors for basically all her life
#tmagp#tmagp spoilers#tmagp s1#it seems p clear that this isnt 'our' georgie or celia would have told her whats happening to her#but beyond that... we'll have to see#tmagp theory#the magnus protocol#magnuspod
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It's kinda funny how many talking corpses are being brought up this episode, both explicitly and non-explicitly. We have the drowned woman Alice came across, the autopsied woman from the case, and.......Georgie. We're reintroduced to Georgie Barker this episode, a character who, in a past world, had fear burnt out of her by a talking corpse.
I wonder if she's connected to the talking corpses in this world, or the Magnus Institute at all, or if she's connected to something else entirely(one of her first lines in this series is "Oh no!! Who keeps taking Georgie's face?" Absolutely deranged😭). She sounds paranoid as fuck about being spied on by the government which makes me think she DOES have fear in this series or, perhaps,,,she has legitimate reasons to be paranoid 👀👀 I wonder what "What the Ghost" is up to in this universe....
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tmagp 18 relisten notes
as usual, tma and tmagp spoilers below cut! sorry this one is so late!
celia:
- she was unable to go into work because of a "childcare emergency" but when we see her perspective we know that georgie was watching jack. on top of that, we learn that celia lied about why she left the house- i think its safe to assume it was related to her teleporting/sleep walking and its becoming a more frequent issue
sam:
- hes uncomfortable being around lena even without directly interacting with her, and feels shes impersonal as his boss
- he asked lena about celia's whereabouts, when he could have texted her himself or she could've updated him, instead he chose to ask their boss about it
- the incident is narrated at his desk, and he draws comparison to the recent encounter alice had- both involving a dead woman recounting the strange way she died
- "she was trapped in her greatest fear, which then actually killed her", its interesting that he was able to clock that with the little context he has -> i wonder if this concept was touched on at his time at the magnus institute
- doubling on the previous observation, sam says he thinks something killed them both, as in a singular force is responsible for their very different deaths. i think that he's right, since this follows similar styles of story pacing/information reveals in the past, but my question lies in what this "something" is: an entity, the fear conglomerate? (fear being a whole force on its own, with the denominations being smaller aspects of it), or a reference to the dimensional rift in some way?
- he thinks gwen is kidding around when she says mr bonzo is an external (reasonably) but once she reacts strongly to him imitating the monster, he does seem to reexamine why she reacted that way. but it doesnt appear that he takes her seriously about mr bonzo, rather taking it as a sign of her deteriorating grip on reality
alice:
- she's attempting to pick up teddy's spirits and encourage him, offering to go out for drinks with him, sam, and celia
- she describes celia as "really weird but in a hot way", which can be taken at face value or as an attempt to joke with teddy (seeing as how she describes her brand as irritating yet faintly erotic)
- after her description of celia, she says that she can make teddy forget his obsession with sam, obviously a joke about teddy, but maybe a subconscious example of her own feelings?
- she's very adamant to sam that she wants nothing to do with the incident even if its similar, refusing to turn to curiosity and making fun of him for suggesting she get her red string out
- she seems actually unbothered by the idea that theres likely hundreds of thousands of entities in their world, and explains the likelihood of them being real/how many there are as if shes mulled this concept over before
- it sounds as if shes heard of others (past coworkers) that try to connect the dots between incidents that affected them and it went poorly, with the best case scenario being no more interaction with the encounter
- sam tells her off for ignoring both the incident and gwen's mental state, which she rebuffs by saying she can ignore it and she intends to continue doing so
gwen:
- after some pushing from sam and alice, she actually tries to open up about her issues, but she has a problem with explaining her experiences, making them not take her seriously
- originally, when she feels supported/encouraged, she tells them how she doesnt think the externals are humans, and takes the leap of faith of revealing mr bonzo is one of them
- once sam makes fun of the mr bonzo reveal, she tells him to shut up and curses, running from the office. this is the first time we as the audience really see her break
lena:
- she picks up on sam being unsettled in the break room, but is surprised that its because of her
- "why would i need to talk to you?/ consider my silence as a compliment"
teddy!:
- he was in the royal mint court area around dusk/whenever the OIAR shifts start, and he says he didn't recognize alice (i severely doubt this as she seems the sort of person to be aggressively noticeable even in the dark)
- he tells her that he was in the area for an interview (assuming the other interview he mentioned in a previous episode fell through)
- he seems to be going through a very rough patch financially and mentally, sounding very beat up and not really meeting alice's energy or jokes as he would in the past
georgina barker, the man the myth the legend:
- she's babysitting jack for celia, but it doesnt sound like they live together or like this is an average situation (celia apologizes for taking up georgie's time, and if georgie were the regular babysitter celia would likely have less issues relating to keeping a sitter
- "who keeps taking georgie's face?" im choosing to believe this is a poke at the fans and not a real foreshadowing of her fate. she survived one entire podcast against all odds i do not know if she can survive both
- shes pieced together that celia is lying about what happens and where she goes during these emergencies, insisting that celia tells her the truth (drawing some parallels between how tma!georgie interacted with jon and his lying)
- she asks celia if shes being spied on by the government, this is likely because celia has a civil service job and wtg probably touches on similar stories, but its very interesting that this is the first direction she goes in, rather than a paranormal one (its possible that tmagp! georgie doesnt believe in the paranormal, having never had an encounter with the End, but i find it unlikely shes a full skeptic
incident:
- our second incident to be narrated by augustus! (im not going to draw comparisons between his themes yet since we only have two to draw on)
- the incident follows the post mortem account of a dead woman named violet parker, taken from a medical examiners investigation into her death, related to a case from the london MET police
- her body was found clothed, dehydrated and malnourished, with an ankle injury and worn feet. and, most notably, dead.
- after the autopsy, violet's body began to speak, telling the story of her death.
- no one had come forward to claim her body, i think this furthers the theory that these speaking corpse's are from an alternate dimension (likely tma)
- violet talks about being trapped within a house that has multiple descriptors of tma fears. including mentions of spiders, loneliness, endless corridors, a person asking questions from an alleyway (similar to the angler fish)
- she describes the house as having too many rooms, passages designed to be confusing, so you have to walk endlessly and slowly starve (correlating to the state of her body). she talks about doing deeds and services for the people in her life out of fear they'll abandon her and she'll be alone.
- violet describes feeling like a lone cloud rolling among her peers as a child, and compares their laughter at her to poetry (drawing very clear parallels to martin's brand of loneliness in tma)
- she says that there was a fog that rolled through the house and disguised her and kept her trapped, but also makes reference to rusted nails, rotted wood, and signs of decay throughout its description, a tie to the corruption.
- the house shes referring to had been demolished in her childhood, but she describes it as a manifestation within her, where she wanders it in her mind. this is closely followed with a description of corridors that twist and confuse her, a common attribute of the spiral and the distortion specifically.
- violet says that someone had brought her to the house, calling them a solitary figure that asks questions from an alleyway. this draws similarities to the stranger and the angler fish, but it also reminded me of the archivist (in terms of asking questions and being responsible for bringing her to this nightmare)
- "it doesnt matter, because no one is here now. because i broke my promise." while this incident isn't narrated by chester, this line still hit me as a strong parallel to jon's final arc, and i wonder if it might be a clue as to his current state of being?
glitches/lies:
- "i'll get by", said by teddy to assure alice he's in a stable situation. poor guy
- "sure. maybe." also said by teddy in response to alice proposing they go for drinks if he gets the job. this cpuld mean he doesnt intend to go do that with her, or that he doesnt expect to get the job (or! he lied about being in the area for an interview)
- "ide ran out of baby food" said by celia, lying to georgie about why she left jack alone
- "im not!" said by celia, denying shes lying
#tmagp#the magnus protocol#tmagp18#tmagp theory#tmago thoughts#alice dyer#tmagp spoilers#gwen bouchard#celia ripley#sam khalid#lena kelley#georgie barker
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Okay, I’m liking all of these theories about Celia… but what if she’s just sleepwalking?
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I refuse to believe the Sam outburst at Gwen moment was real, in the episode about being trapped with your fears? Not to say people who saw it as a natural response from Sam are wrong, I just don't believe it personally. His tone and way of speaking is consistent, not to say that you can't switch your tone mid conversation but going from "very serious, give me information im curious" to "bursting out laughing" and then immediately back to "very serious"? Alice and Sam both responded like Gwen was acting weird, like Sam didn't just burst out laughing at Gwen, out of all people Alice would of said something about it.
The haunting booms and tension while it was happening was also a pretty good sign at least to me that something was off? It's like Gwen was so desperate and fearful of opening up about the externals and being brushed off like it was a joke that her reality changed and the fear itself took hold making it true to her.
I don't know if this is anything but I felt like throwing my hat into the ring as nobody has mentioned it, even if it is just a theory, I'd love for people to re-listen to that entire thing from Sam talking to Alice till Gwen storms off with this in their brain.
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Little Magnus Protocol theory: Originally I had thought that the body Alice encountered was the tattooed corpse from TMAGP 11, but now I'm thinking it's not connected to that but rather to whatever Sam and Alice accidentally released from the Magnus Institute ruins.
Sam theorizes that the victim in TMAGP 18 and the body Alice encountered could have been killed by the same thing, an entity that is causing people to be "...Trapped in [their] greatest fear. Which then actually killed [them]." And what else do we know in the Magnusverse that trapped people in their greatest fear? Well, the Archivist sorta did that, didn't he? Trapping people in endless looping nightmares, reliving their fears every night...
Additionally, the body Alice encountered had a tape recorder with her, that's how we end up hearing that whole exchange. Where was the only other time we've had a tape recorder in Protocol? Well, when Sam and Alice accidentally freed a horrible monster from underneath the Magnus Institute ruins!
I think that the [Error] that was freed from the institute ruins was a former Archivist, and that Archivist is now going around and trapping victims in their greatest fears in order to feed off their fears.
Could I be wrong? Sure, probably don't have enough details yet. But given the details we DO have, this seems like what they might be pointing to
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Me, enjoying loose, mostly symbolic connections to TMAGP while researching alchemy
vs
Me, finally getting to 19th century spiritual alchemy (the connections are no longer loose and symbolic)
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